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This is fascinating. I feel for the FLDS who might have the rug pulled out from other them. I think it should happen, but it will hard for them if it does happen. |
or merely that he is seeking to escape responsibility from a situation that he never really believed in. Or that he is seeking to escape responsibility from a situation that he totally believes in by “lying for the Lord.” |
‘Lying for the Lord’??? Like when I lied to my wife and told her the Lord told me to buy a 60 inch plasma. I believe in the screen and escape responsibility of it’s purchase by hiding behind false doctrine. His followers will remain adament to the cause, if even out of pure embarrasment for living a lie and wasting so many years of what could have been a happier time. |
Out of all the extraneous modern-day polygamy sect stories, this one takes the cake, as far as I’m concerned. It will be very fascinating (if not sad) to see how this unfolds. |
I hadn’t seen this yet. Thanks for the heads-up. |
I tell my friends not to put any stock in what the media says concerning the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. It does seem that if Mr Jeffs had something to say the media and the courts out to let “HIM” say it. I am not saying that Mr Jeffs has or has not made a statement - I am just saying, I do not trust the media and I do wonder why this is not being done in the “light of Day” without all the beating around the bush. jonathan m |
I think for his followers to believe this, they would need to see him (in person or at minimum on a videotape) saying this in a context where he is not under some kind of coercive custody. Maybe I’m missing something, but this looks like a rumor without a specific named source behind it. |
Jonathan M, What on earth has he ever done in the “light of Day”? I can’t recall anything. |
Great post, Matt. Thanks for both pointing this out and for providing such an insightful analysis. |
Thanks, all. OG - It’s not as clear to me as it is to you that Jeffs has been faking all along. That’s part of what makes this whole thing so intriguing to me. I have no idea what he believes, and I don’t know that it’s at all possible for me to find out for certain. LL’s option - Jeffs as John Taylor - is a possibility. As are Jeffs as David Koresh and Jeffs as L. Ron Hubbard. d and Jonathan - Apparently the Trib’s sources are 1)A couthouse official; 2)A prison official who was privy to Jeffs’ conversation with his brother in which he expressed similar sentiments; 3)Some tricky photography enhancement done on the photograph in the article. It appears that technology is powerful enough to read pen marks through the paper. Q has done good work this time. |
It’s KSL and the Deseret News, not the Tribune, who are digging on this story (the Trib merely prints that “the DesNews is reporting that …”). I wish these two outlets would be a little more circumspect in pushing this story. It just looks bad. I could paste here a hundred or more eastern newspaper articles from the 1870s reporting on Brigham Young’s health, and rumored withdrawal from business, and supposed rebellion among LDS faithful, and expected demise of the church. They all sound just like what KSL and the DesNews reports. It was ugly then, and it’s ugly now, especially when they’re interviewing sources who betray their official responsibilities by tattling on jailhouse communications, and who are snooping with with tech photography to read notes that a defendant is holding in his hand. It sounds too much like the Mormons are jubilant (relieved?) that a rival prophet may be exposed as a fraud. Why? What does that have to do with us? |
I am confused by the Deseret News story– it says in the graphic at the bottom of the page that they “flopped” the image, so that the text would read from left to right. I can believe that they might be able to make out the text in a high resolution photo taken from across the room– but that seems to imply that they also were reading it through the paper– or am I just hopelessly confused? And this seems to me that it might cause a mistrial– but I don’t know much about that. |
Paula, Yes, apparently they got a photo of the back of the sheet and then flipped it. Ardis, I agree that the tactics being used here are a bit unseemly. But I think that you exaggerate are perhaps mischaracterize the reaction and the story. He wasn’t “revealed” as a fraud so much as he seems to be attempting to admit that he is one. It isn’t clear if this is a sincere admission or if it some sort of weird legal maneuver. In any case I don’t think that Mormons (especially those in Utah) view him as a rival prophet so much as a person that creates a negative perception of the state. I think there are obvious reasons beyond rivalry to explain why some might view this as good news. |
arJ — Until and unless his message, whatever it is, is made public through his own will (either thru a personal statement in court or some other public venue, or by a spokesman he chooses, thru the same public venue), then it’s dirty, underhanded, espionage. You can’t pretend that the Des News is altruistically doing Jeffs a favor by revealing his note because the judge wouldn’t? If the man weren’t Jeffs, or if the subject matter of his note were defense strategy, or instructions for selling a house, or a letter of encouragement to a child, you would perhaps more easily understand why I object, and why I wish nothing even remotely connected to the church were so gleefully playing spy. |
Ardis, Please re-read the first sentence of my response. I agree with you about the spying part. |
Jeffs’ slipping the note to Judge Shumate wasn’t that big a news here in southern Utah. Or maybe I missed that party. The judge is really mad at the local paper, feeling they’ve created problems for him by sensationalizing the whole thing. Which I thought was kind of funny, the TV stations were reporting that the Daily News had sensationalized the story. I feel that Jeffs may be facing that man in the mirror and is sincere in repudiating himself. That’s got to be painful. On the other hand, he is a very rich and powerful man, still. It seems like he could have made a public announcement in a more effective way than slipping the judge a note. It’s probably not the last we’ve seen of this circus. |
so where is the proof? How does anyone know this is true?? The media dosen’t tell the truth. |
[...] Wednesday October 31st 2007, 1:11 pm Filed under: David Grua, Fundamentalism Rumors have floated around since January that Warren Jeffs had renounced his role as Prophet of the [...] |
[...] Rumors have floated around since earlier this year that Warren Jeffs had renounced his role as Prophet of the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints and that he had not held the FLDS priesthood since he was twenty years old. Court documents containing these allegations had been sealed so as not to influence jurors in his recent trial, but the judge recently reversed this decision and released the documents. Jeffs recanted these confessions in February of this year. [...] |
This is of interest to me because the judge I’m investigating is refusing to let me view the video tapes of his sentencings. James Shumate, the judge in this case, was my lawyer eons ago when he first got out of law school. He did my will. He got his wife to witness it and was all official and I thought he was just so sweet. I’ve always liked him and if he got criticized, he didn’t deserve it. |
If you follow the links from #19 you will find that the released documents were of an affidavit taken while Jeffs was in Purgatory Correctional Facility. This story just keeps getting weirder and stranger by the day. |