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Not to sound too negative about the movie, by the way, I should add that I look forward to seeing it. I love a good Western. |
John, you did a lot of work and this is great. You set up a central place to refer to, well done. In my studies of MMM the last few months, I’ve come across two direct ancestors of John Main Urie, who participated and is rumored to have married the surviving child Philip Klingonsmith adopted. The Urie line is still embarrassed about it all and most won’t talk about it. The others, not so much. What amazes me is the importance of the human element in this tragedies. For instance, years ago I watched a news story about a tragedy in Japan and my heart ached and tears ran down my face. People I never knew and never will know halfway across the globe. I still talk to people, strangers, who remember when my husband and son were drowned in a lake in Nevada. For Mountain Meadow, individuals were hurt and those hurts have been generational. I’m going to see this movie. Perhaps they did the best they could without our unique inside perspective. Mormon Wasp has my gratitude as well. Very well done. |
Thanks John |
I think the Ensign article will achieve that much more readily than this post. |
I don’t know, your post was great I thought… But, I was actually referring to all of the hype around the movie including the Ensign article, the many posts on the subject, etc. |
Over the last year, the church has been getting a lot of attention, I suspect it is because of Mitt Romney’s run for the Presidency but who knows it might have happened anyway. While a good amount of it, like this movie, is not presented in a manner the church would prefer, I argue that all of it is good for the church; especially for our missionary effort. For me I think it is all good. |
Wasn’t the original release date May 4th…opposite Spiderman 3? That would be a good and reasonable explanation for delaying it, right there… |
I’m using Firefox and a large portion of this post is buried under the right sidebar for me. It seems to be due to the long URL strings at the end of the post. Perhaps you could hyperlink to those posts at the Wasp rather than use the entire strings. I suspect that would solve this glitch. |
Thanks for pointing that out. That would be the obvious solution. The only reason I did it this way was to be able to display the URLs for heightened ease of access. |
Baron, this post isn’t actually a speculation on why the movie was delayed. That was a facetious sentence in the first paragraph. The more important point was that, regardless of the reason for the delay, perhaps it is useful because more and more information about the details of the massacre that critics of the Church for some reason downplay or do not focus on is being transferred from inaccessible print sources to searchable online sources. |
Geoff, it should be fixed now. |
Perfect. Thanks. |
My friend John Hamer saw the film last week when he attended the dedication of the Community of Christ Visitor’s Center in Kirtland. The local theatre was showing it, and called and invited them to come. He doesn’t know if the LDS missionaries were also invited, however, he did not see any of them in attendance. I won’t link to his review, but I will share with you what he said in our discussion last night and in those written reviews: it’s crap. It’s not just bad history, although for the Co-Executive Secretary of the John Whitmer Historical Association, bad history is probably enough of a reason to think it’s a crappy movie. It’s that the movie is…crap. Poor filmmaking. My favorite line from his review: “Apparently, the Fancher Party was emigrating to California so they could have Protestant worship services every day all day, because that’s about all they did in the movie.” John also said that there were some not-subtle depictions of the 19th century temple ceremony. Here’s a review of the movie from April: |
That’s disappointing, isn’t it? I look forward to something and it’s crap. Thanks for the warning, Ann |
It’d probably be more trouble than it was worth but I wish we could slap the producers of this movie with a slander suit. It’s bad enough they’re slanting history so badly. All the historical evidence in the world can’t do any good if it’s not a part of people’s lives. For better or worse, this movie is probably going to define Mormon for a lot of people. Yeah critics think it’s a bad movie but I don’t think that means much. “Titanic” was a lousy movie too, with all the emotional depth of a slice of processed cheese but that didn’t stop it.* Like I said, it’s bad enough that they’re slanting history. That they’re depicting temple ritual of any era is, to me anyway, deliberately insulting and provocative. I don’t even want to know how they make it relevant to this storyline. This whole thing makes me sick. *Apologies to those who liked it but I really, really hated it. As you probably guessed. |
[...] temple ceremony has already been discussed on this blog. On John F’s thread on this movie, Ann made a comment that mentions John Hamer’s reaction to the movie, including his indication that it depicts portions of the 19th century temple ceremony. Ann [...] |
I saw this movie too. First, I have to say that the Temple Ceremony was portrayed very accurately. Most people do not understand that the Ceremony has changed over the years. Also, that the movie trailer is out of context with the storyline of the film. I have seen alot of responses breaking the dialog down from the trailer, but you have to remember that it is only a trailer. The movie addresses relevant moments of history such as Brigham Young’s deposition and order not to harm the immigrants and the assassination of Joseph Smith. Actor Jon Voight recently appeared on “The View” to discuss the film with Barbara Walters. The link can be seen at: This was an interesting and powerful film. Some people may not agree with it and it will force people to choose sides, but the acting is phenomenal. |
Joe Brown, Could your astroturfing be any more obvious? Please tell us more about yourself and why we should believe you. Jon Voight’s appearance on The View only cemented my opinion that he is clueless and the movie likely to be one-sided. |
Crud. How do you hear YouTube? I tape The View, but I deleted that one because Jon Voight sort of makes my skin crawl. I used to like him, I loved Coming Home, and I loved Conrack. But lately his hair is too long and greasy and he keeps proclaiming his love for his daughter without accepting responsibility for his actions. Ick. Shudder. I didn’t realize he was going to talk about this movie, though, I would have liked to hear what his view was. A couple of weeks ago, one of John Main Urie’s direct descendants, a member of our ward and a friend, spoke in church. He cried, he talked quietly about how those men sold their souls and they paid for it. Life is just sad. I’m depressed now :). |
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