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Even when I worked at FARMS 11 years ago (when it was still called FARMS), Hugh Nibley’s new book was perpetually forthcoming. I wonder what happened to it.
It’s interesting that Harold Bloom identifies Joseph Smith as a Hebrew prophet, arguing that he did his prophetic work in the same way they did theirs. |
I was contacted by FARMS (well, Maxwell Institute now, but it’ll always be FARMS to me) last summer as part of a fundraising effort to specifically fund the final editing and publication of One Eternal Round, so I hope it appears sometime in the next few years. From what I recall of a conversation with a senior FARMS scholar a few years back, part of the challenge was not just the size of the manuscript but the fact that there were, in effect, two or three draft manuscripts — and with Nibley gone, it wasn’t clear which reflected his final intent. ..bruce.. |
I don’t see how RSR shows that the Environmentalist argument fails. From RSR it is pretty clear that whatever Joseph was doing when he was translating he 1) wasn’t looking at the plates and 2) He was using the peep stone/Urim and Thummim to dictate the words. Bushman seems to come down as favoring the transcription theory, i.e. that translation was really transcribing off what Joseph saw in the stones. How does that refute the environmentalist theory? What’s to stop a skeptic from saying that he was absorbing it from the environment and then retelling it while using the stones for effect? I’m not saying that I necessarily believe this, but I don’t see Bushman as showing that the environmentalist argument fails. |
David: Certainly Joseph Smith could have dictated the book to his scribes from any source, including his own imagination. As you say, most of the time he didn’t refer to the plates at all. Perhaps I could have been clearer. What I’m trying to say here is that the role of a translating seer itself has no precedent in Joseph’s environment. If we was wanting to found a religious movement from precedents around him, he would have followed the model of, say, Ann Lee, or William Blake. And to be clearer, this isn’t my point (though I agree with it), but Bushman’s. Joseph Smith learned the most about his role as he was performing it. |
When Nibley got old it was all given to John Gee to organize. It was reportedly very disorganized. Since John has his own projects plus his teaching plus being in Bishoprics and so forth. Who knows when it’ll come out. |
I have not read many of Nibley’s books but I have read transcripts of his lectures to an Honors BoM class at BYU back in the 80s (published as “Lessons from the Book of Mormon”). They are extremely difficult to follow, as he rambles, goes off on tangents, and references material that I doubt would be familiar to anyone but himself. On the other hand, I have read a little of some of his other works, which seem to be much more coherent. So I imagine that from draft to final product is an extremely laborious for him (moreso than it might be for most authors). |
Does it matter if we re-frame the issue as “bringing forth new scripture” as opposed to translating? I don’t have the answer to this, but I am thinking of Mary Baker Eddy (who is not a contemporary of JSJ but comes after him) who produced Science and Health almost as new scripture, or at least an extremely influential and necessary commentary for Christian Science. |
The Mary Baker Eddy parallel is an interesting one. I think it should qualify as scripture, at least to the Adventists, because beyond health advice she also had several prophecies. |
With regard to the question of environment, the keynote speaker at the 2005 JWHA conference compared Joseph’s family background with that of Mary Baker Eddy and Ellen White. Fascinating material. |
With MBE and EW coming after Joseph Smith, did they somehow take inspiration from him? Was “revealing new scripture” now part of the recommended course for those starting new religions? If Joseph Smith’s role as translator was unprecedented in his cultural milieu, then where did MBE and EW get it, if not from him? |
Revealing new scripture wasn’t all that unprecedented. Translating existing, ancient scripture was, for a religious leader. |
Revealing new scripture wasn’t all that unprecedented. Translating existing, ancient scripture was, for a religious leader. The problem is that after I read Bushman I got the impression that the Book of Mormon was a translation in name only. Translation implies reading in one language and then transforming it into another language. The plates were covered up at all times, precluding any type of translation as the word is normally used. That’s one of the reasons why Bushman comes down on the transcription side of things. So my question to you is this, How is it valid to claim that what he did was unprecedented because it was translation, when what he did was not in any way related to how we use the word translation? By that logic I am one of the world’s greatest ice skaters, provided that we define ice skating to be, “sitting on one’s butt writing software to pay the bills.” |
Yes, David (#12), we do have to wonder what Joseph Smith meant by “translation”. Clearly he didn’t mean it the way Charles Anthon would mean it, unless he had a committee of translators, dictionaries, and original language sources in that hat of his. He means it the way King Mosiah meant it. But what does that mean? I don’t know for sure, but if it’s anything like I experience when giving a Priesthood Blessing, there are certain impressions I get. I try them out with words in my mind, forming the phrase, and then praying silently if it “feels” right. If it does, I say it out loud. Other times, during blessings, a stream of knowledge will come to me instantly, like a flash. It’ll take less than a second to come to me, but can take quite a while to articulate. It’s possible that one or both of these processes is what happened to Joseph, since both of these are described by him, the first in D&C 9, and the second is described in chapter 10 of our Joseph Smith manual this year:
But all this is a bit off track, I think. The Book of Mormon claims to be an ancient record. Joseph Smith claimed the records were given to him from an ancient prophet. He claimed to be in physical possession of actual gold plates. However we want to imagine the book was actually produced, it is these claims that are unprecedented. Lots of others were having visions, of God, Angels, and about the end of the world. No one else was claiming to have been given ancient plates and the means to translate them. And if we believe the witnesses to the bringing forth of the book, then the methods of production (dictation by looking into a hat, reading off about 8 words, spelling out names, and after pauses picking up right where he left off) were also unique. If you believe Smith cooked it up over time, with help from other people and writings, then of course that method has wide precedent, since it’s how you write pretty much any book. And if you believe, against the claims of Smith and the book itself, that it is a modern new scripture with allegorical and mythical locations and history, then this is not very unique either. Judged on those standards, though, it’s not a very good book. No wonder people who believe that don’t really actually read the book much. |
[...] posts thus far are the introduction, Bushman, Brodie and Respectability, Fatherhood and Fraud, Where the Environmentalist Argument Fails, and Revelation. That’s quite a few posts in just a few days. Many of the comments are worth [...] |