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1. I don’t think there will be a United States of America, and certainly not either a Democratic or Republican Party. 2. I think we’re going to spend an awful lot of time cleaning up records in the Church. Anyone who has been a clerk can tell you that the records are awful. Randomly, go in sometime and check your Individual Ordinance Summary (IOS) — this is a version of your record that shows when you were baptized and confirmed and (if your a male) when you were ordained to the most recent office (and who performed it). Go ask your ward clerk for a copy (you’re entitled to it and the new tithing settlement rules call for it to be distributed at TS, anyway). You’d be surprised at how many of these records have errors. You’d be surprised at how many records are missing things like birthplace and birthdate! Or maybe you wouldn’t be surprised. At any rate, I think we’re going to be receiving many, many angelic visits to help us clean up our mess and sync our records with the Big Book Upstairs. 3. If people could hear the message of the gospel with Jesus Christ on the earth and *NOT* hearken, then why is it such a surprise that people might fall away? At any rate, I think that the initial impetus is likely to be on technical grounds — “ah, it’s great the Christ is here, but I don’t need the priesthood”. After that, you’re going to have people who basically have forgotten what happened 1000 years before and rebel — the idea of life in the Millennium will so be ingrained that when Satan is loosed, it will seem so “revolutionary” that people will follow. |
I enjoyed the post, Bruce. Here are some comments, reflecting agreement, extending from each of your points. 1) Prior to transfigurations or resurrections to immortality, mortal longevity may increase dramatically, to the point that we no longer age — reflecting both trends in current research and prophecies in the D&C. Also, we may soon be capable of producing meat that was never sentient at a cost lower than that of meat that was sentient. Even if we don’t become vegetarians, I suspect that most humans will end up, in the not too distant future, choosing not to kill for sustenance. 2) Several leaders of the Church have expressed this idea. Here is a great quote (one of many) from Brigham on that subject: “You may now be inclined to say, ‘O, this is too simple and child-like, we wish to hear the mysteries of the kingdoms of the Gods who have existed from eternity and of all the kingdoms in which they will dwell; we desire to have these things portrayed to our understandings.’ Allow me to inform you that you are in the midst of it all now, that you are in just as good a kingdom as you will ever attain to, from now to all eternity, unless you make it yourselves by the grace of God, by the will of God, by the eternal Priesthood of God, which is a code of laws perfectly calculated to govern and control eternal matter. If you and I do not by this means make that better kingdom which we anticipate, we shall never enjoy it. We can only enjoy the kingdom we have labored to make.” (Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses 3: 336) 3) The Mormon Transhumanist Association (transfigurism.org) has a lot to say about this. Also, a good book on the subject is “The Singularity is Near”, by Ray Kurzweil. 4) I don’t necessarily expect the Church to exist forever. There seems to be scriptural anticipation of the Church being superseded by other divine organizations when its mission is complete. 5) We are already facing some incredible risks associated with changing technology and social trends. I don’t think we can even begin to imagine the sorts of risks that will follow — not because we haven’t chosen to think enough about it, but rather because we’re not anatomically capable (yet) of thinking enough about it. |
queuno (#1): Good points all. As a BYU undergrad in the 70s, I once wondered out loud to one of my CS professors, “I wonder when they’ll bring back the United Order.” He immediately quipped, “I keep wondering when they’ll bring back the Council of Fifty.” (That was the first time I’d ever heard of it.) As for the ‘Christ present’ issue, there is a difference between Christ as a mortal in His ‘Suffering Servant’ role and Christ as the Resurrected Son of God in his ‘Conquering King’ role. But your point still applies (hence Pearson’s poem). Lincoln (#2): Also good points all (and I threw in the ’singularity’ reference with you in mind; really, I did). I like the idea of cloned cultured meat tissue replacing livestock; I don’t think we’re more than a decade or two away from that (though I’ll be interested to see PETA’s response to that development). As for your 4th point, “Wherefore, may the kingdom of God go forth, that the kingdom of Heaven may come…” (D&C 65:6). Still, I think that it may not be so much that the Church goes away as that it devolves many localized organizations. After all, all aspects of the ‘threefold mission’ will still exist and, if anything, will be more intense (as per Card’s quote at the top of the post). I would argue, in fact, that the Church has been moving towards that decentralization for at least 20 years, in part to help the Church continue to function as a church through potentially catastrophic upheavals prior to the Second Coming. Still, Christ may still want His twelve Apostles and quorums of 70. And thank you, thank you, thank you for your observation in your 5th point. I firmly believe that we are physically incapable of perceiving and comprehending almost everything about ‘reality’ — one of the major differences between us and God. We tend to get a bit cocky and definitive about what really is and how things really work when I think we’re truly blind to most of existence. ..bruce.. |
The New York Yankees might still exist during the Millenium, but they will perpetually be in last place in their division. Unless someone wants to suggest that God is not just… |
For the sake of speculation, I always thought that the best systems on earth were organic in nature. We have been able to produce so little of what the natural world accomplishes in terms of energy and resource cycles. I suspect one thing we have to learn is to replicate organic systems. |
Nasamomdele, reflecting your speculation, the scientific community is already investing substantial time and resources in improving scanning and reverse-engineering of the various parts of the human body, particularly the brain. |
We are going to live on this planet the way in which God intended. During the Millenium, there won’t just be advancements in science but all fields of learning. The greatest paintings, symphonies, sculpture, have yet to be produced. Man is now living under comdemnation because we do not live the celestial law or even the Terestial law. But when we do the spirit of God will be unrestrained and inspire man in economics, science, technology, art, agriculture,and architecture. We cam also look forward to recieving the sealed portion of the Book of Mormon which is an abridgement of the writings of Ether by Moroni and which contains an account of the vision of the Brother of Jared. |
The “Millennium” will be a fantastically different era. They that do wickedly shall be turned to stubble. i.e. they will be killed. How many wicked are there in the world? What about their philosophies? The world will be fundamentally altered. What are we going to do with our nuclear weapons? Launch them into the suns? What about all the other weaponry? What about the companies that have been making money creating weapons of war? Are they “the wicked?” What about our economic system? What kind of disruption of pay will we have? The lives we live, especially here in America, are dependent on a more complex system than the agrarian lifestyle of the past. It has to be able to continue or we’re in trouble. |
Didn’t Brigham Young say the stars and stripes would still be flying in the millenium? |
I like the post starting out with the def. from OSC, and I really like the poem. My views on the Millennium have changed over time. As have my views on when the Millennium will occur. Something big is going to have to go down in order for a new world order to be instituted strong enough to rule, but potentially allow other governments, all working together for a thousand years. It’s an interesting thing to wonder about, but now for different reasons (speaking for myself). |
Interesting post! I also think we don’t pay much attention to the prophecy in Zech. 14:16-18, which to me indicates that we will be keeping the feast of tabernacles again, and the subsequent drought on Egypt (Moslems?) who refuse to worship the Lord. |
All excellent comments, which is why haven’t been responding. However, I have found a post about cloned meat (as opposed to meat from cloned animals): Bring on the Meat Factories. It may well be that by the end of this century, people will look at our eating of slaughtered livestock the same way we look back at more rustic delicacies such as pickled pigs’ feet, blood sausage, and tripe (all of which I’ve eaten, by the way, though the pigs’ feet were the only ones I enjoyed). In the meantime, I plan to do some serious grilling this weekend. |
I’m with Orson. |
The New York Yankees might still exist during the Millenium, but they will perpetually be in last place in their division. Only if the Red Sox are disbanded first. |
Didn’t Brigham Young say the stars and stripes would still be flying in the millenium? I haven’t heard that, but it wouldn’t surprise me if he had said it. But even so, what does that mean? That Christ will the duly-elected head of the government, subject to an imperfect constitution and subject to being overruled and constrained by a legislature and a supreme court? I doubt it. Let the flag fly, but the government will not exist in any democratic form that we recognize. |
[...] coming will then come back down to earth — still mortal — and start the long task of cleaning up the mess we’ve made of things down here. faith-promoting story — Any story that makes you feel glad you’re [...] |