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Sister Orwell doesn’t have a secret way of annoying the sleep out of you? No deadly ticklish spots or knowledge of bunions, incipient boils, or other pain centers? If not, I’m afraid DKL will just have to suck it up and take the blame. |
If the room is over 74 degrees, I struggle. If it goes over 76.5 degrees, I am a goner. I have stopped wearing suits to church altogether, because anything more than my shirt and tie puts me over my heat threshold. |
I thought I was the only one that happened to! I finally started carrying a copy of the Hor Book of Breathings (~ Abr. Fac. #1) and during the meeting, I can sketch heiroglyphics to my heart’s content. But if I don’t pick it up immediately after the sacrament – I am a dead man. All meetings do this to me, but especially sacrament. I am just not a verbal learner – it usually shuts my brain off. |
My husband is notorious…in fact, his whole male family is; father, brothers, all 15 nephews, right on down the line, sleep in meetings! At family gatherings, for blessings and so forth, it’s common for several to snore, and I do not mean softly. If I (or a child) poke, elbow, nudge, etc, husband, he gets very angry. He has often said that the next bed we buy will be in the shape of a Church pew, because he sleeps better there than home in bed. I have no cure, but you are certainly not alone! |
What a wonderfully written post! I’m so glad you’ve come onboard MM. So does this phenomenon strike only in LDS meetings? Have you tried an African Methodist Episcopal meeting? How about an i-pod with Gladys Knight music? (You have to have the right haircut to conceal it.) President Kimball used to keep his feet one inch above the floor to prevent himself from sleeping in church. My husband bites his tongue–literally; he sometimes gets it bleeding. He also pinches himself. (If I were on the stand with him, I would gladly do the pinching.) Probably a glop of eucalyptus between thumb and finger would do something interesting. |
Margaret, you’re so cute. President Kimball kept his feet an inch off the floor because his feet didn’t reach the floor. Did you ever see the dear fellow? |
Great post! When I’ve slept through sacrament meeting, it’s been because I didn’t get out of bed. I wish I could fall asleep as easily as you do. |
Dan, (#1) I’m suprised they’ll let you get away with just a shirt and tie at church… Nobody has recommended pants for the occasion? :) I’ve fallen asleep in a Poli Sci and Comparative Psych class in college but I can’t think of a time (outside of my toddler years) when I have fallen asleep at church. Perhaps you could try to work this out of your system by standing in the back rather than sitting in a chair/pew. You could even offer to wranlge a few pew monkeys for some of the other parents in the ward. Or try one of DKL’s methods for making it through Sacrament meeting and start blogging! I’ve been known to send text message to my husband at home when a meeting bores me, too. Just try to keep the snores to a minimum and let the day’s speakers know you appreciated their efforts and your sleeping had nothing to do with the content (or lack there of) of their talks. |
If I get a couple of kids on my lap in Sac meeting I am a goner. Out like a light. I am not alone though. Many men are asleep in the pews in our ward on Sunday. I have also seen people on the stand start dozing off. |
Grandma used to listen to the Dodger game and keep score, even when Grandpa was on the stand. |
Orwell, this is a brilliant insight. The same thing happens to me at the exact same point in the temple ceremony. I’ve always been baffled by it– didn’t seem to have any kind of correlation to any other factors (time of day, amount of sleep the night before, etc.). I hadn’t considered a Pavlovian phenomenon. Thanks! |
We had some loud snoring in EQ just 10 days ago. I am somehow able to stay awake in church, but years ago I fell asleep regularly during physics dept. meetings. I would chug a Dr Pepper before the meeting and have a second one open on the table for sipping. Plus a Snickers bar! But it was no use! I rudely zonked out in nearly every meeting. I also had a hard time staying awake during discussion on my mission until I had a firm grasp of the language. |
I am an unrepentant pew sleeper. I consider it the duty of the speaker to keep me awake, so if I’m asleep, it’s their failing not mine. When I speak in church, I make it my primary object to ensure that no one falls asleep. Perhaps I feel this way because of training I recieved as a missionary. John K. Carmack came to our mission and gave a presentation on speaking in church. His first piece of advice is that people are generally prepared to fall asleep at any time, and that your job as a speaker was to give them a good reason not to do so. This may not cure the hardcore pavlovial sleeper, but it would probably help all the other types: better speakers. We should do more training on the order of Carmack’s. |
MCQ, I might be wrong, but anecdotal evidence that I’ve collected suggests that Elder Carmack is tilting at windmills on this one. That said, I wish him success. |
MCQ wrote: “We should do more training on the order of Carmack’s” and I say AMEN! I might be a little biased because of my history studying and teaching Public Speaking but I would whole heartedly approve of a “Sacrament Talks for Beginners” class. I offered to teach one in my ward at some point (though rephrased it for the Bishop’s sake) but haven’t been taken up on it yet. I think the general policy in most wards is just grin and bear it. I can’t tell you how many times I’ve groaned inwardly at a terrible attempt at humor in a talk (occasionally also audibly if the joke was bad enough). I also hate (Did I say hate? I mean HATE!) it when a speaker starts with, “When Brother Johnson called me two days ago to see if I could speak on why Sunday comes after Saturday…” Nobody cares how long you had to prepare! Even when most people are asked three months in advance they’re still writing out their closing “InthenameofJesusChristAmen” at 11:59 the night before. Just tell us your opinion on why the Patriot’s playbook should be canonized and let’s get on with it! |
Marta–do you know how fun it is to have just celebrated my 53rd birthday and be labeled as “cute”? Thanks! I did indeed see Pres. Kimball in person. (I wrote an article for the Genesis newsletter about that, which is likely still up. http://www.ldsgenesisgroup.org . ) It is actually true, however, that Pres. Kimball used the method of lifting his feet slightly to stay awake. He spoke about it at least once, but I have no idea where to source that. I heard him say it in a talk. In all seriousness, I have been working with wonderful missionaries who really struggle to stay awake for some of the meetings. I personally believe that fewer quotes from GAs, fewer scriptures (sorry!) and more personal stories to indicate how the scriptures apply–and how they can be better understood–would help us all. I charted a recent speaker at the MTC and found that his talk was 90% quotes from either GA talks or the scriptures. I personally think we read the scriptures too rapidly and without devoting real time and meditation to them. I have noted in meetings in non-LDS churches that the pastor will often use ONE scripture as the theme for his/her entire talk. I’ve heard it happen in LDS meetings as well, but more often, I hear a litany of quotes. We have developed a template, I’m afraid, and we all know how to produce a talk–but it’s usually a boring talk. I also think that those with narcolepsy problems should be assigned to bring musical instruments to accompany the hymns (though this won’t happen for another decade). I vote for the triangle, the conch shell, the tambourine, bongo drums, and the marimba. Eventually, I want Orwell assigned to be the back-up music for speakers, using the instrument of his choice–including his own, gentle humming or the quietest of bird calls. |
I can’t recall Anyone sleeping in my church (Mennonite). |
Margaret I think you make an excellent point about the high quote and scripture count in most Sacrament meeting (SM) talks. I think people often feel at a loss as to what they should say on a topic and just find as many related quotes and scriptures as possible. One of my favorite pastimes in SM is seeing how many of the same quotes and scriptures speaker #2 will use that the first speaker also used in his/her talk. This goes right along with those who like to pull out the dictionary for the most simple of topics (“the word patience is defined as…”). It’s filler and very, very rarely has anything of real value to add to the talk. I find the quotes issue also arises quite frequently in RS. I don’t know if the guys in Elder’s Quorum have the same problem but I can’t tell you how many times I’ve had a lesson basically read to me while waiting for the teacher to pause long enough to look up and see if anyone has a comment (are we surprised that I almost always do?). I’m a big fan of sticking to the material provided but how about some discussion? (I’d like to have some discussion in SM, too but it will probably be adopted as quickly as the tambourine and bongo drums Margaret would like.) Back to the talks in SM… We provide classes for the teachers, why not for speakers as well? I understand that giving a SM talk isn’t a calling but we’ll all give one eventually so why not offer an occasional class to help people out? I would bet the Bishopric would receive fewer refusals (or last minute illnesses) if people knew they had someplace to turn to for help. |
#1: Yes, Sister Orwell has sharp enough elbows to wake me up, but she is not always there. Besides, most of the time she is so enraptured with the speaker that she only notices when it’s already ten minutes too late. #11: Tagore, maybe you and I should have a couple of campouts in the chapel and the temple. We won’t set alarm clocks or anything, we’ll just wait until the meeting or ceremony wakes us up. Think of it as reeducation… it will cure us for sure. #15: I hate that too! “When Brother Johnson called me…â€, lame humor (especially the “your spirit was lifted and your heart was touched†one), the dictionary, and any reference to how much time you had to prepare irritate me to no end. (You can even go for the triple crown and combine items 1, 2, and 4.) However, I should also add that I have been uplifted and edified by talks that include some or all of these things. Unfortunately, like ward choir, church talks often cannot be “fixed”; though I am sure most of us would agree that sometimes it doesn’t matter. #16: I would prefer back-up music to speaking or sleeping any day. I used to volunteer to do musical numbers when I was asked to talk, and I almost always got out of speaking. I agree with your scripture/quote sentiments as well, though I know lots of people in the exact opposite camp. #17: Guy, you and your religion are clearly superior to ours. Thank you so much for condescending to commune with our unworthy selves. |
This is really ancient history, but extremely cogent to the whole Pavlovian idea: About 10 or 15 years later, this same Prof. Allen gave the opening (I think) prayer in P/H session of General Conference. Afterwards, it seemed at least half of the congregation was snoozed out. |
I always get sleepy when people talk to me. Bill falls asleep every Sunday and he’s not a lazy, sleepy person, as am I. Once he fell asleep while singing a hymn and dropped the hymbook on the floor. He snores. Once, long ago, when Sarah was small, we all fell asleep. She slept on our laps and I leaned on Bill’s shoulder and we all peacefully napped through Sacrament Meeting. Good topic :) |
I was fascinated by this thread but fell asleep while I was reading it. What were we talking about again? |
There are some sacrament meetings that I am positively grateful that I’ve slept through. Count your many blessings. |
Solution: No-Doz, or generic caffeine tablets. Hey, if Diet Coke is kosher, then pure caffeine should okay with the WoW, right? One of the major things that puts me to sleep, even if I have caffeine in me, is the “Utah sing-song” voice pattern. It’s hypnotic. I also seem to fall asleep as a sort-of defense mechanism if the speaker is projecting too much of themselves (their own spirit instead of the Holy Ghost) in their talk and I just don’t like their personality. Many times I can just be overly sensitive to what people are spiritually projecting, and what many people call “The Spirit”, is merely their own spirit/personality, and if they’re being maudlin, it turns me off like a switch. An overly warm room will do it too. |
Jim Donaldson, How would you know? |
:) |
I can read the bulletin. |
My grandfather, who farmed in Southern Idaho long before automated sprinkler systems, would have to get up every 4 hours to change the water on his fields. He was once asked if he ever slept for 8 hours straight. His response – “I would if church lasted that long.” |
There was a family in my ward in Madison, WI, who came every week, and as soon as the sacrament was done, all collapsed snuggled up together and slept through the rest of the meeting, till the closing hymn. They had five or six kids, and I’ve always admired their ability to get even the toddlers to sleep like that through church. I had only two kids, who woke at the crack of dawn, and quit napping by age two…. no rest at church for me. |
In my days of counting attendance, I could always ensure I was awake during the closing speaker, because that’s the best time to count. |
I have resorted to a 15-30 minute nap just before church and a bag of trailmix or mixed nuts in my scripture case. There’s about a 60% success rate. |