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| Thursday, March 11, 2010 |
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- A Bird's Eye View
- A Motley Vision
- Adventures in Mormonism
- Blogger of Jared
- Blognitive Dissonance
- By Common Consent
- Don't Let's Start
- Ethesis
- Exponent II
- Face of the Other
- Faith Promoting Rumor
- Feminist Mormon Housewives
- Flooding the Earth With the Book of Mormon
- Golden Road to Samarqand
- Head Life
- Just Sayin'
- Juvenile Instructor
- Latte Day Saints
- Messanger & Advocate
- Millennial Star
- Mormon Matters
- Mormon Mommy Wars
- New Cool Thang
- Nine Moons
- Popcorn Popping
- Proud Daughter of Eve
- Purim
- Rhapsidiom
- Segullah
- Spinozist Mormon
- Sunstone Blog
- The Cultural Hall
- Times & Seasons
- Unofficial Manifesto
- Zelophehad's Daughters
It’s funny. I don’t know anyone who watches Big Love who isn’t already a member. |
Thanks for sharing the Nibley quote (By the way where was he last week when we needed him I agree we need to have no reaction. HBO only gets hype, and free advertising, and better ratings because we react. No reaction = story dies. Over reaction = media hype. Yes, we need to ignore it next time. Except to come here and get the facts on what was aired maybe Madeline |
). What a great quote. My husband and I read and discussed it. I loved the part where he said “Anyone who would reveal these things has not understood them, and therefore that person has not given them away. You cannot reveal what you do not know!” “The best reaction is to ignore it and move on” – words that should be memorized by all Mormons everywhere. “I don’t know anyone who watches Big Love who isn’t already a member” – probably; seems to me that mormons have kept the series alive. What’s the viewer average? 5 Million? compared to some 40Million for 2 & 1/2 men? |
I believe that the airing was a blaspheme. On the other hand, it turned out a great discussion among Mormons and their friends about the sacred and Mormon doctrine. That nothing was said afterwords didn’t surprise me, mostly because I didn’t think there was much hype to begin with outside of Mormon confines. I just wish it didn’t take a blaspheme to get members to talk more openly about the Temple experience. What amazed me was, since some Mormons actually talked, how many members felt the Temple experience was rewarding and had meaning. In my mind I actually thought I was the only one who felt that way; and that came with some serious pondering, prayer, and study. The only stories I ever heard were how uncomfortable someone was or is toward going. Although I don’t support quoting or talking directly about the Temple ceremonies, the “cone of silence” I feel is spiritually damaging. Hugh Nibley saved me because he was not afraid of talking even in hints. I do think that the leadership of the LDS Church has been a little more open to direct discussions over the last couple of decades. The membership has a long way to go. |
I actually agree. But it’s upon the heads of the people involved; as the Lord says in D&C 64:11, “And ye ought to say in your hearts—let God judge between me and thee, and reward thee according to thy deeds.” We’re supposed to forgive them (D&C 64:10) and move on. As for the temple itself, you can count me as one more person who loves it and who more often than not gains insights when I go. There is a significant amount of excellent LDS literature available on the temple — not just Nibley’s writings, but the volumes put out by the BYU Religious Studies Department, such as Temples of the Ancient World and The Temple in Time and Eternity. But these last two volumes are out of print, and their approach is scholarly and oblique. I also agree with your desire to see more open discussion. I would love to see a slim book on the temple and temple symbolism, written for the general membership, that distills down the key insights and correlations from all these scholarly works. But it would really need to be done under Church supervision and with Church approval, as much to ease controversy and suspicion over the book as anything. ..bruce.. |
Well put, Bruce. The only impact for me was that when I went to the temple the other night, during the last part of the ceremony I couldn’t get Barber’s Adagio for Strings out of my head. The thing is, it’s actually a pretty good piece to have in your head in the temple. And you’ve chose a quote from Nibley that I actually like. |
Well written Bruce. I had at least two co-workers who are major fans of the show (in general) and let me know that some weeks ago. They had some questions for me on Monday and I did my best to be helpful (without divulging anything I’m not supposed to). I should also add that I gave them links to comments of LDS people on these blogs. I haven’t watched the episode so I figured those people could respond better than I could. |
I agree. |
I agree that the infamous HBO episode seems to have quietly gone away. However, that doesn’t mean that some of the hand-wringing and dialogue wasn’t important. Mostly, I think the Church was spot-on correct to post its response at the Newsroom. The Church has a duty to set the record straight – even if the gist of what was said about the episode was a big yawn. |
I spent a little time on the internet looking around to see how the public responded to the ceremony itself. I didn’t find a whole lot (probably because I didn’t search hard enough or in the right places), but what little I found suggested that people didn’t think much about it one way or the other. I got the impression that aside from those who already despise all things Mormon, a lot of people didn’t think of the ceremony as much out of the ordinary in the context of religious ritual and religious vestments in general. There are those assume that if it is secret, there must be something shocking or embarrassing being covered up: animal sacrifices, drunken orgies, satanic spells, cheering for the Yankees, that sort of thing. But having seen the episode, people generally seemed to go away wondering what was so alarming about the ceremony that it needed to be hidden. Or they were just talking about soap-opera-y aspects of the plot without paying much attention to the temple scene. A few viewers even said that the ceremony was impressive and beautiful. What I read may not be entirely representative of the public reaction, but it does seem to me that we may tend to overemphasize the degree to which the public will ridicule the content of the ritual when it is presented without the scornful spin that has been customary in anti-Mormon portrayals. |
Off the subject, maybe: It’s interesting to note that the language, spelling, punctuation, etc. are much clearer and cleaner here than on most of the other comment blogs. Congratulations on some literary intelligence. |
What “Big Love” thing? Already forgotten, bub. |
Just like a roman candle firework, it went up with a big bang and fizzled out to nothing. My wife and I happened to see the Temple portion of the show on YouTube before it got pulled. It was about 90% correct in many ways, but of course, the spirit was not there. And there were several things that were just ridiculous like yelling in the Celestial Room and the matron telling them their 15 minutes was up. I laughed out loud at that one. The excommunication scene is still on YouTube and is one hundred percent WRONG? If I were a non-member looking at that, I’d think we were a bunch of nuts, which is what Tom Hanks and the producers of Big Love intended. On the other hand, I am sure that this will have a positive outcome in the future because Big Love is obviously fading fast if they have to resort to this type of sensationalism. More people will become interested in find out the turth about the Church as a result. |
Thank you for the quote from Nibely. It’s a gem. I felt that the dedication of the Draper Temple this weekend was a most fitting response: we “cheerfully do all things that lie in our power.” (D&C 123:17) In light of the evil use by blasphemers of video and satellite technology, there was, to me, delicious irony in our use of the same technology in dedicating the temple. It enabled the Church to turn stake centers throughout Utah into an extension of the temple and to unite thousands in a joyful celebration. In his remarks during the dedication, Elder Russel M. Nelson repeated some of the same teachings contained in a video that the Church has released to YouTube. Appropriately, the video also contains member testimonies and scenes from inside the Draper Temple. hthalljr’gmail’com |
Left Field – “What I read may not be entirely representative of the public reaction, but it does seem to me that we may tend to overemphasize the degree to which the public will ridicule the content of the ritual when it is presented without the scornful spin that has been customary in anti-Mormon portrayals.” I was never too concerned about what the non-LDS community might think about the temple ceremony (in general I don’t put a lot of effort into concerning myself with the perceptions of others) but I was concerned with what this portrayal in BL might lead to in the future. My fear would be that the knowledge becomes so common that the understood importance of the endowment would be diminished. I really don’t want people asking me, “So what’s with all the health in the…” I suppose it’s a double edged sword, though. Secret = scary. Out in the open = loss of importance (to others, not myself). “…there must be something shocking or embarrassing being covered up [in the temple, like] cheering for the Yankees…” That would be shocking and embarrassing! Why don’t they add that question to the temple recommend interview? |
TDub – “Congratulations on some literary intelligence.” Thanks! We done been tryin’ our bestest! |
When we moved to DC, I used to tease our branch president each year during temple recommend interviews. He’d get to the question, “Do you affiliate with any group or individual whose teachings or practices are contrary to or oppose those accepted by The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, or do you sympathize with the precepts of any such group or individual?” And I’d say, “Well, I am a registered Democrat….” (he was, as well). We’d both crack up, and then he’d move on. ..bruce.. |
Jeff; how do you know what the excommunication scene is like? I can’t believe 40 million people watch 2 1/2 men. |
As much as we fear the damage done by shows like “Big Love,” my personal experiences have been quite the contrary. One of my dearest friends, who is not LDS and had made it very, very clear that she has no interest in hearing/talking about our church whatsoever, suddenly had questions and we had a dialogue because of this show. She hasn’t approached me about the temple scenes, and I think I might even paraphrase this quote by Nibley in my explanation of why I won’t talk about everything she saw, we’ve had some really great discussions about the church. |
My mission president Elder Bruce McConkie made the statement that “all press is good for the church, good or bad” The church had to make a soft statement, however, any church memeber that has an AOL account or any subscription to any Time Warner magazines should go ahead and cancel thier subscriptions. Dont use Big Love as the reason, jsut do it!! The best thing we can do is hit their pocket books. Considering todays circumstances, they gotta be going thru tough times like the rest of the publishing industry !! |
