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	<title>Comments on: Councilling</title>
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	<link>http://www.mormonmentality.org/2009/09/17/councilling.htm</link>
	<description>Thoughts and Asides by Peculiar People</description>
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		<title>By: ESO</title>
		<link>http://www.mormonmentality.org/2009/09/17/councilling.htm/comment-page-1#comment-113517</link>
		<dc:creator>ESO</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Sep 2009 01:25:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mormonmentality.org/?p=2305#comment-113517</guid>
		<description>dblanchard--glad to have you.  Although I don&#039;t find ushers necessary, I would definitely chose that job over taking out the garbage!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>dblanchard&#8211;glad to have you.  Although I don&#8217;t find ushers necessary, I would definitely chose that job over taking out the garbage!</p>
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		<title>By: dblanchard</title>
		<link>http://www.mormonmentality.org/2009/09/17/councilling.htm/comment-page-1#comment-113514</link>
		<dc:creator>dblanchard</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Sep 2009 21:52:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mormonmentality.org/?p=2305#comment-113514</guid>
		<description>I just discovered this site, and am loving the conversations. 

ESO, I think you are right that in the case of volunteers, you work with what you have, but even if I were asked to usher at stake conference, I would consider myself a volunteer. True, I wouldn&#039;t have eagerly raised my hand and asked for the privilege, but I also wouldn&#039;t hope for any additional blessings to be added for my service to the many that I already enjoy.

You are definitely correct in saying that ushers simply block passage through the doorways.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I just discovered this site, and am loving the conversations. </p>
<p>ESO, I think you are right that in the case of volunteers, you work with what you have, but even if I were asked to usher at stake conference, I would consider myself a volunteer. True, I wouldn&#8217;t have eagerly raised my hand and asked for the privilege, but I also wouldn&#8217;t hope for any additional blessings to be added for my service to the many that I already enjoy.</p>
<p>You are definitely correct in saying that ushers simply block passage through the doorways.</p>
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		<title>By: Orwell</title>
		<link>http://www.mormonmentality.org/2009/09/17/councilling.htm/comment-page-1#comment-113488</link>
		<dc:creator>Orwell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Sep 2009 19:38:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mormonmentality.org/?p=2305#comment-113488</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;â€œBecause,â€ he said, â€œyou donâ€™t see [then] President Hinckley singing in the Tabernacle Choir, do you?â€&lt;/blockquote&gt;

That&#039;s the dumbest thing I have ever heard.  The Stake President should have responded, &quot;Of course not, he&#039;s tone deaf.&quot;

Just out of curiosity, speaking of presiding authorities and singing, does anyone know if there is some kind of rule (written or otherwise) about the presiding authority remaining on the stand during choir numbers?  In my experience, the space on the stand is usually limited and the bishopric or stake presidency seriously gets in the way when everyone comes up out of the congregation to sing with the choir (obviously this is all dependent on the layout and size of the chapel -- sometimes there is no reason for them to move, and sometimes there&#039;s enough space for the choir to sit on the stand throughout the meeting).

I don&#039;t have any qualms with asking them to move for the duration of the musical number -- they&#039;ll enjoy it more if they&#039;re not conspicuously stuck in the middle of it anyway.  However, some leaders refuse to move.  I always get very annoyed when they won&#039;t when it is clear that practicality demands that they do so.  My sense is that their reasoning is usually along the same lines of &quot;You don&#039;t see President [Whoever] leaving the stand, etc.&quot;

I suppose there is always the danger that, without their presiding influence, the choir might sing some ancient pagan summons to demons of the underworld or something.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>â€œBecause,â€ he said, â€œyou donâ€™t see [then] President Hinckley singing in the Tabernacle Choir, do you?â€</p></blockquote>
<p>That&#8217;s the dumbest thing I have ever heard.  The Stake President should have responded, &#8220;Of course not, he&#8217;s tone deaf.&#8221;</p>
<p>Just out of curiosity, speaking of presiding authorities and singing, does anyone know if there is some kind of rule (written or otherwise) about the presiding authority remaining on the stand during choir numbers?  In my experience, the space on the stand is usually limited and the bishopric or stake presidency seriously gets in the way when everyone comes up out of the congregation to sing with the choir (obviously this is all dependent on the layout and size of the chapel &#8212; sometimes there is no reason for them to move, and sometimes there&#8217;s enough space for the choir to sit on the stand throughout the meeting).</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t have any qualms with asking them to move for the duration of the musical number &#8212; they&#8217;ll enjoy it more if they&#8217;re not conspicuously stuck in the middle of it anyway.  However, some leaders refuse to move.  I always get very annoyed when they won&#8217;t when it is clear that practicality demands that they do so.  My sense is that their reasoning is usually along the same lines of &#8220;You don&#8217;t see President [Whoever] leaving the stand, etc.&#8221;</p>
<p>I suppose there is always the danger that, without their presiding influence, the choir might sing some ancient pagan summons to demons of the underworld or something.</p>
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		<title>By: John Mansfield</title>
		<link>http://www.mormonmentality.org/2009/09/17/councilling.htm/comment-page-1#comment-113485</link>
		<dc:creator>John Mansfield</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Sep 2009 18:08:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mormonmentality.org/?p=2305#comment-113485</guid>
		<description>But is it really possible to be preacher and choir simultaneously?  While the bishop is following direction of the choir director, who is presiding?  Him or her?  (And why does that sound better than &quot;He or she?&quot;?)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>But is it really possible to be preacher and choir simultaneously?  While the bishop is following direction of the choir director, who is presiding?  Him or her?  (And why does that sound better than &#8220;He or she?&#8221;?)</p>
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		<title>By: queuno</title>
		<link>http://www.mormonmentality.org/2009/09/17/councilling.htm/comment-page-1#comment-113471</link>
		<dc:creator>queuno</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Sep 2009 02:42:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mormonmentality.org/?p=2305#comment-113471</guid>
		<description>My bishop sings in the ward choir.  Because he has the talent to do so.  He also sings in a band.  I applaud church leaders who support the choir with their feet.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My bishop sings in the ward choir.  Because he has the talent to do so.  He also sings in a band.  I applaud church leaders who support the choir with their feet.</p>
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		<title>By: Scott B.</title>
		<link>http://www.mormonmentality.org/2009/09/17/councilling.htm/comment-page-1#comment-113469</link>
		<dc:creator>Scott B.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Sep 2009 02:30:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mormonmentality.org/?p=2305#comment-113469</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;I have never, ever seen a female usher. When I go to stake conference and an usher points out an empty seat, I smile and sit somewhere completely different.&lt;/blockquote&gt; 
That&#039;s extremely helpful, considerate, logical, and all-kinds-of-obnoxious of you. Well done!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>I have never, ever seen a female usher. When I go to stake conference and an usher points out an empty seat, I smile and sit somewhere completely different.</p></blockquote>
<p>That&#8217;s extremely helpful, considerate, logical, and all-kinds-of-obnoxious of you. Well done!</p>
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		<title>By: Hunter</title>
		<link>http://www.mormonmentality.org/2009/09/17/councilling.htm/comment-page-1#comment-113459</link>
		<dc:creator>Hunter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Sep 2009 19:24:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mormonmentality.org/?p=2305#comment-113459</guid>
		<description>Ardis is smart to bring up Temple Square as an example of why we don&#039;t have to limit ourselves to male ushers. Great point. 

But this made me think of an experience where following a &quot;pattern&quot; from Temple Square doesn&#039;t always produce such favorable results: Our current Bishop -- a man who loves to sing in choirs -- refuses to ever sing in the Ward Choir while he&#039;s Bishop.  The reason why is because, when he served in a stake presidency, a visiting AA70 told the stake presidency that they were to stop singing in the Stake Choir.  Why?  &quot;Because,&quot; he said, &quot;you don&#039;t see [then] President Hinckley singing in the Tabernacle Choir, do you?&quot;  

(For this music-loving Bishop, he refrains from singing in the choir as a sign of obedience.  He&#039;s a wonderful man, and I don&#039;t mean to slight him.  The whole thing makes me laugh, though.)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ardis is smart to bring up Temple Square as an example of why we don&#8217;t have to limit ourselves to male ushers. Great point. </p>
<p>But this made me think of an experience where following a &#8220;pattern&#8221; from Temple Square doesn&#8217;t always produce such favorable results: Our current Bishop &#8212; a man who loves to sing in choirs &#8212; refuses to ever sing in the Ward Choir while he&#8217;s Bishop.  The reason why is because, when he served in a stake presidency, a visiting AA70 told the stake presidency that they were to stop singing in the Stake Choir.  Why?  &#8220;Because,&#8221; he said, &#8220;you don&#8217;t see [then] President Hinckley singing in the Tabernacle Choir, do you?&#8221;  </p>
<p>(For this music-loving Bishop, he refrains from singing in the choir as a sign of obedience.  He&#8217;s a wonderful man, and I don&#8217;t mean to slight him.  The whole thing makes me laugh, though.)</p>
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		<title>By: ESO</title>
		<link>http://www.mormonmentality.org/2009/09/17/councilling.htm/comment-page-1#comment-113457</link>
		<dc:creator>ESO</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Sep 2009 16:21:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mormonmentality.org/?p=2305#comment-113457</guid>
		<description>Anne--you&#039;re my kind of lady!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Anne&#8211;you&#8217;re my kind of lady!</p>
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		<title>By: Anne (U.K)</title>
		<link>http://www.mormonmentality.org/2009/09/17/councilling.htm/comment-page-1#comment-113451</link>
		<dc:creator>Anne (U.K)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Sep 2009 10:47:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mormonmentality.org/?p=2305#comment-113451</guid>
		<description>I have never, ever seen a female usher. When I go to stake conference and an usher points out an empty seat, I smile and sit somewhere completely different.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have never, ever seen a female usher. When I go to stake conference and an usher points out an empty seat, I smile and sit somewhere completely different.</p>
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		<title>By: queuno</title>
		<link>http://www.mormonmentality.org/2009/09/17/councilling.htm/comment-page-1#comment-113433</link>
		<dc:creator>queuno</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Sep 2009 02:04:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mormonmentality.org/?p=2305#comment-113433</guid>
		<description>We used to call couples without children or who had teenage children to be ushers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We used to call couples without children or who had teenage children to be ushers.</p>
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