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The attempted assassination (and almost murder) of a congresswoman and the murder of the Chief Judge of a federal court isn’t worthy of a president’s speech? Really? |
Alaska’s in the black not because of Sarah Palin’s abilities, but rather they pump money right out of the ground. |
Pretty much every other commentary I’ve read about this came to the opposite conclusion that you did. The only real criticism was with the crowd, which he had no control over. The president addressing the nation during a time of mourning is completely appropriate and not without precedent. |
I’m curious: Was President Obama making a press speech or was he speaking at a funeral/memorial to which he was invited by the family of the deceased? I’m pretty sure it’s the latter, in which case complaining about him politicizing the event is rather silly. But I could be wrong. |
Alaska and North Dakota are in the black because of high oil prices and low populations – nothing to do with nitwit Governors. I didn’t vote for Obama, but I thought his speech was nice – a bit of a pep rally with the crowd cheering, but overall a good speech during a time of mourning. To infer that Sarah Palin would be either smarter or a better President is pretty offensive to me given Palin is a moron… IMO |
A credit to his race? Really? Does it upset you when he gets too uppity? Remember, he’s white as well. So assuming you have some Anglo in you, he’s also a credit to YOUR race. IMNSHO, I thought it was a great address, and very appropriate considering a Federal Judge and a Federal Congresswoman were shot. |
Did he give a speech when North Korea attacked South Korea? That felt like a real national issue to me. South Korea does not want the US to make DPRK-ROK relations in general, and the Cheonan/Yeonpyeong Island attacks in particular, national issues of its own. Yes, the US nuclear umbrella/military presence plays an important role in the region, and North Korea would prefer to deal directly with the US, but South Korea is adamant about taking the lead on these issues. To the extent Obama held his peace, it was probably at their request. |
Let me help Obama for you “GO! FIGHT! KILL!” There, does that help? That’s all you need, isn’t it, Arlene? |
Is this really how you assess a president? By whether he chooses to preempt your favorite TV show? And do you have any idea how racist your post sounded? I think I’m the one who’s embarrassed…for you. |
You’re right. He’s an awful leader. He just never shuts his trap — never. He’s constantly talking, and then whining that people don’t “get” what he has to say. Now, he intrudes upon a memorial service with a speech that was 2 or 3 times the length of the speech that Bush gave in front of Congress after the 9/11 attack, and they give out t-shirts with specially designed branding material. When Reagan had to deal with the disaster of the Space Shuttle Challenger, he gave some brief remarks from Oval office — and he actually had some memorable things to say instead of hours of dribble. Honestly, the way he went on and on, I half expected Obama to lapse into his cap-and-trade advocacy mode like he did when he talked (again endlessly) from the Oval Office about the BP disaster. I’m embarrassed for all the knee-jerk idiocy we see in people rushing to his defense. They, at least, have the president that they deserve. |
Linda, I suggest you go back and read Anne’s post completely rather than forming an opinion based on skimming. His preemption is what brought this speech to Anne’s attention, not the source of her dissatisfaction with him. Palin doesn’t get any credit for Alaska being in the black because she quit being Governor years ago, during or just after the election I think. |
Mormon Mental, indeed. |
Chris H, as someone who is so exquisitely sensitive to insults, you sure are comfortable throwing them at others. But I’ll tell you what: If you can demonstrate that you’re able to offer a critique of those whose political opinions you disagree with that isn’t positively dripping with hate and vitriol, then we can talk. |
Had Alaska been in the red when Palin took over and in the black when she left, we could indeed praise her for that. But that is not the case, as many others have pointed out. I am confident that, had Obama NOT spoken at this memorial service, many people would have criticized that, too. Personally, I think that his visit and talk were apt. If “losing his train of thought and looking down” because he was touched when talking about the 9-year-old victim from Saturday’s shooting is evidence of poor leadership, I welcome more poor leaders. I thought it further proof that he is human. I like human presidents. |
DKL, 9: After a bit of searching, all I could find is that Obama was invited by the host of the memorial service, the University of Arizona, to attend and speak. Thus, I still don’t see how he “intruded upon a memorial service.” http://uanews.org/node/36904 Also the t-shirts were designed and placed by the hosts: http://nation.foxnews.com/arizona-shooting-rampage/2011/01/13/t-shirts-handed-out-tucson-memorial |
why do people say dribble when they mean drivel? |
Devyn and ESO, if Alaska were in the red, it wouldn’t matter who’s fault it was, everybody would blame Palin. It’s bizarre how liberals will brook no compliment of Palin. If something goes right in Alaska, there are always extenuating circumstances, because Palin can’t possibly be the cause. BrianJ, he intruded upon the service by speaking interminably. I was at a Republican meeting in which Senator Hagel was invited to speak. He just went on and on. That speech was an intrusion. If Obama knew when to shut up, he’d have saved himself an embarrassing intrusion. And nothing happened at that service that wasn’t OK’d by Obama’s event people, who are marvelously fluent at creating tacky, over-done ornamentation (like the Greek Temple thing from which Obama delivered his acceptance speech at the 2008 Democratic Convention), but have terrible judgment when it comes to discerning taste — as evidenced by the entire “memorial” pep-rally spectacle. Obama has the mistaken belief that every problem can be solved by a good speech. It’s tempting to think that the fact that he gives so many speeches that go on for so very long is due to a desperate attempt to solve as many problems as possible. Unfortunately, the sadder, simpler truth is that (like other immature politicians) he has not yet realized that other people don’t enjoy hearing him speak as much as he does. Obama is an utter joke, and it’s humorous to see the left sputtering to try to explain it away. If he doesn’t tighten things up over the next year, his re-election prospects are not likely to be very good. |
I agree with Peter re North Korea. Beyond that, I saw nothing in Obama’s speech to get worked up over either positively or negatively. Lincoln gave the perfect funeral address at Gettysberg and all presidents should follow his lead by keeping funeral remarks short and to the point. But aside from being too long, Obama’s speech was fine. |
What is embarrassing is the pseudo-presidential speech Sarah Palin gave from her own living room, which was fitted with a comically large American Flag designed to make it look like some bizarre Alaskan version of the Oval Office. Poor Bailin’ Palin just can’t stand to see the all the media attention directed away from her. Watch closely, and you will even see the glare from a teleprompter in her glasses: http://vimeo.com/18698532 |
DKL, That is pretty funny coming from one of the most abusive people on the bloggernacle. I am sure annegb has good intentions. As for you…well…fluffy puppy to you. |
I did not listen to the speech (I make it a point of not listening to presidential speeches after an election–I think they are all campaign speeches.), but I read the text. The text looked balanced and like what needed to be said in probably as neutral a way as possible. A fair number of conservatives have agreed. Even the Christian radio stations I listen to, who are generally knee jerk conservative, agreed. It is not surprising that a number of Mormons cannot find anything good to say about Obama, no matter what he says or does (including the memorial address)–given that Mormons are the most conservative and republican of any group in the U.S. I am glad, Annebg, that you are rooting for our president. I am sorry his words did not come across the same way to you as they did to me. And DKL I consider a good cyber friend. If he was not calling for Obama to step down at least once an hour, I would be disappointed. ;) |
I think it entirely proper for the sitting president to speak at something like this event. I found his speech to be fair and balanced. |
I have no comment at all about Sarah Palin’s video, except that I commend her for her intent of helping (and I think that was genuinely her intent. I disagree with her about almost every issue, but I do not question that she has a good heart. Same is true with GWB, and reluctantly I would agree, even with Cheney.) |
DKL – being Governor of a state with less people than most cities for six weeks (ok I know a little bit longer) means that any impact she had was likely minimal. However, I did like her when she was first put forward as the VP (Note I did vote for McCain and her). However, the more she opens her mouth, the less I like her… |
Fair enough. I liked her as VP as well, but she’s stagnated since then, which means that she’s gone downhill relative to expectations. Palin is proving to be like the child TV-star who never rises above the disfunction created by too-early celebrity. Thus, she, seems to have stopped developing as a political figure. The spotlight and controversy brought on by her nomination as VP has led her to retrench rather than evolve, and the consequence is that she’s frozen in time and will never transcend her role as the controversial but intermittently compelling VP candidate on a losing Republican ticket. |
bbell, perhaps it was appropriate for a president to speak at such an event, but was it appropriate for him to speak and speak and speak and speak? |
Palin is a simpleton and Obama is the bees-knees, or vice-versa? Anyone who doesn’t recognize that 1) Obama is barely fit to manage a Cracker Barrel much less govern a country, 2) Palin is doing more harm than good for her purported causes, 3) both are excruciatingly, painfully, over-exposed, really needs to pay closer attention. Obama gets the shaft because his chance came too soon. He is so miserably unprepared for the job that it seems like he isn’t even aware of all the ways he is screwing up yet. Unless his is presidency improves by degrees it will be judged a failure. I predict that his post presidency will be so long and so painful it will make Hillary Clinton look like a young Julie Andrews. Palin gets the shaft because she has been treated like garbage. I can’t imagine what people think that she has done to deserve the treatment that she receives at the hands of so-called-progressives. She was a good governor by any measure, she appears to be a genuinely caring and optimistic and considering the political make-up of the country nothing she says is really extreme. Political yes, but hardly extreme. Yet for some reason she scares the bejeebees out of the coastal “elite” (which says much more about the coastal elite than it does about Palin). What the country needs is a president who is more mature and has more wisdom than both Obama and Palin put together. |
Mac, I agree. I wish Reagan was back. |
No Linda I wasn’t upset about the show, I always try to listen to the speeches. The thought just occurred to me that he didn’t seem presidential. And no, I don’t know why it sounded racist, but I do get accused of that rather frequently. I think we could dance around the fact that he’s black. I choose not to. If that’s racist, so be it. |
Linda, have you read his books? |
Come on, MAC. You and I both know the President would make an excellent Cracker-Barrel manager. Annegb – I’d be curious to know where the AARP got their information. I always thought that most state constitutions didn’t allow the carrying of debt. Virginia, for example, has to balance their budget every cycle. |
I’m glad he spoke, and it was very appropriate. North Korea-South Korea is not a national issue, it’s an international issue (a very important issue, yes, but not “national” per se). I think what he said was very presidential in terms of trying to bring the country together and promote healing, rather than the partisan blaming that so many others had been spewing. |
Oh great, now that annegb isn’t going to vote for Obama in 2012 he might not win those Utah electoral votes. |
Geoff, you laugh, but I remember a few Democrats who used to post here who were sure that Utah would go for Obama! |
Ha! |
Remember these words that’s the real mormon mentality…. 12. We believe in being subject to kings, presidents, rulers, and magistrates, in obeying, honoring, and sustaining the law. 13. We believe in being honest, true, chaste, benevolent, virtuous, and in doing good to all men; indeed, we may say that we follow the admonition of Paul—We believe all things, we hope all things, we have endured many things, and hope to be able to endure all things. If there is anything virtuous, lovely, or of good report or praiseworthy, we seek after these things. Joseph Smith |
Tim and CJB78: I think Korea is a national issue. I feel very badly for the family of that little girl who was killed—and of course it’s a terrible thing that a crazy person shot a federal judge and a congresswoman. However, their lives (congresswoman and judge) aren’t any more worthy of speeches than all the others who are killed in this country every single day. Yes, violence is rampant in our society and it’s awful. Which brings me to Brian: I think your question makes a good point. Because I came home, bearing burgers, about 5 minutes into the speech. I thought it was an emergency communication thing to the nation. I didn’t realize it was a speech at an event. Which does make a difference as far as context. However, if the president wants to make violence an issue in his presidency, there are many other things he can do as well. I still think he came off lame in the speech and usurping regular channeling (I do try to watch the speeches, I think it’s a citizen’s responsibility) just seemed to hit an off note. It seemed, uh, not sincere. Because people are killed in senseless ways every single day in America. Let’s make it a central issue. Let’s not usurp regular channeling at the last minute to give a lame-o and uninspiring speech. There’s just a lack of leadership quality. Although, really, I haven’t felt good about a president in a long long time. Truly good. As mad as I am at Bill Clinton over the way he treated women in his personal life, I think he’d do a million better job at running the country right now. Devyn, she’s not a nitwit. Her voice drives me crazy and she’s not sophisticated, but she’s accomplished some pretty substantial things in her life. Those are not the acts of a nitwit. Yeah, it bothered me seeing her with the dead animals on her show, but I could also see real dedication to her state and her family. To hard work. Those are pretty non-nit-witty attributes. |
Last night I was thinking about how Clinton shut up crap, I can’t remember his name, the leader of Libya. Nipped it in the bud. Although, wasn’t he president during the Somalia debacle? I’m thinking maybe my emphasis—and fear—of major conflict shouldn’t overtake anxiety about the situations inside our country. The economy, yes, the violence, the morals of our youth–and old! are a scary thing to consider. I was watching a little bit of CSI-NY last night and it was about these bars where they have a mechanism that allows people to inhale alcohol, just drenches them with it. DKL, you would have done a better job at this than I. I wish you would post more on political events. Maybe we should have some sort of open debate between you and a liberal. PDOE, Oh! and DAMIEN! I think she did quite a lot. Of course, I got it from her book. Then I googled it to get all sides and decided she pretty much told it like it was. This is a woman who, yep, kills her own meat, but she works her butt off preserving and cooking it, too. We need more of this ethic. ESO, The president did speak out about what happened. I wasn’t waiting for further words. This coverage has been a lot of lack of other stories happening. Now, I’m not minimizing what happened. But like I said, what about all the boys killed overseas, or the killings every single day? I thought the president handled it okay till I watched that speech. It wasn’t only the pre-empting or the fact that he gave a speech or my misunderstanding context, but he seemed sort of wandering and ditzy, maybe that’s because of the way he talks (my husband talks just like that, pauses, drives me crazy). A lack of conviction about his own topic? I don’t know. Can’t put my finger on it. Cwick, well, she’s not spending buckets of money on her publicity. They actually showed that o |
I keep hitting the buttons and deleting or posting before I’m ready. Thanks for your comments. Cwick, she did a thing on her show with a tv spot like that. It seems lame too. But she’s not the president. Geoff, do you really think he’ll run? To give me credit, you have to admit a lot of people in his own party are disenchanted with him. To whoever said that about him being Anglo, you’re right. But he writes a lot about his struggle to find identity in his book and I got the impression that he would identify as a black man first. I don’t think it’s racist to note that race plays a part in this presidency. It did in the election and in the way many of us watch and perceive. And I would like a stronger president in the first black man elected to the presidency. David and bbell, I don’t know if I deleted this or not, but I owe everyone an apology for my lack of context. I missed the start of it. But what remains is my conclusion that the speech lacked fire. We needed a Neal A. Maxwell, to say simply, succinctly and powerfully, “this has got to stop.” |
annegb, Do you really think the President usurped the regular channels? That he laid down his fist and said, “give me the airways or I will destroy you!”? If you’re mad about your normal program being overtaken, I think you need to blame the network, not the President. They didn’t have to put the speech on the air. And I do think the fact that a congresswoman (who represents a part of the U.S. Legislative branch) and a federal judge (appointed by the President and who represents a part of the U.S. Judicial branch) deserve a little more notice and attention from the President (the Executive branch) than the average citizen. Are they more worthy of speeches? Certainly, much in the way a General Authority is more worthy of an eulogy from the Prophet than you or I are. |
I thought it was an address to the nation, Tim. The shootings got a lot of attention—I didn’t feel it warranted a speech to the nation. But that’s beside the point that I think he’s a weak president. Poorly made. No excuses. But still a good point. |
Ed @ 29
I don’t really think so. I do think that he would be a measurably better president after six months as a Cracker Barrel manager. |
I object to that denigration. It bothers me. |
We needed a Neal A. Maxwell, to say simply, succinctly and powerfully, “this has got to stop.” No, any speech given by Maxwell required a dictionary to be handed out. |
I had a chance to talk to an AP White House correspondent, they noted that the president is an extremely professional and tightly managed individual. If he were a manager of a Cracker Barrel, it would probably be the most precisely run one in history. I think, perhaps, there are cultural differences at play. |
I didn’t feel it warranted a speech to the nation Well, part of the issue is not whether or not he was “addressing the nation” but rather whether or not the news organizations decided it was something that should be carried. |
An interesting editorial in tomorrow’s Washington Post: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2011/01/14/AR2011011403871.html McCain’s response to Obama’s speech (and a few other things). annegb, 35: thanks for the reply. I didn’t watch the speech and I have no plans to: It was part of a memorial service for Tucsonians and others who are personally affected by the shootings—and that does not include me. Of course, I realize that the national media has determined (not “decided,” but “determined”) that lots of Americans are interested in the story…. |
Wow, thank you Brian, that’s a really good editorial. I wish I could have put my opinions half as well. I agree with McCain about Obama’s patriotism. I got that from his books, too. Also that he’s a caring person. I’ve tried to watch the speeches more diligently because he’s been criticized so much and I want to give him the benefit of the doubt so badly. My attention span is short and I don’t understand a lot of the deep political and intellectual stuff that you guys do, but he comes off as detached and not really committed. He writes better than he talks—-which, totally off the subject, so does Dr. Laura :). Sarah Palin basically sucks at both. Brian, you make an excellent point, this was the story in the media. As soon as Britney Spears does something crazy, it won’t be as crucial. Again, all, I totally misunderstood the occasion for the speech. I missed the first of it and skipped the commentary. Of course it was right that he would be asked to speak at that event. Still, there’s something off, I can’t quite put my finger on it. |
Stephen, that insult bothered me. I think he’s a president like Jimmy Carter, whose influence and talents will be more effective when he’s not president. You know, I saw something about Reagan’s son saying Reagan had Alzheimer’s when he was in the White House. I believe. Which, hell, is the president no more than a figurehead? Reagan never failed to seem like a strong fatherly figure. And how much do appearances figure in? Bush often seemed bombastic and almost stupid. So who are the true leaders? What are the qualities of a good leader? What do we need in a president? I wondered once if truly compassionate people make good presidents. The kind and meek men in my ward aren’t the leaders. The leaders tend to be a little bossy and insensitive. Well, I guess they can’t all be Jesus. |
One attribute of a good leader is the people who they get to work for them. I don’t know all of the cabinet, but I do know Kathleen Sebelius and she is amazing. Also Bob Groves at Census, who just pulled off a cost-effective and well done Census, really hustling to catch up with some messes left behind by the previous administration, which tended to make appointments based on politics rather than competence. And if you want to show respect for him, try using the title instead of just referring to him by his name. “I read in my AARP news….” The AARP is a hateful organization that promotes generational fratricide. I refuse to join no matter how many great discounts they dangle. |
Thanks, Naismith. I think I referred to every president mentioned in that way, so it’s equal opportunity disrespect. I haven’t made up my mind about AARP. I wouldn’t characterize them as you have. How do they promote fatricide? I do love the discounts. I read their magazine and the newspaper carefully. And get some good ideas. Others I don’t agree with. Take what you like and leave the rest. How do you know Kathleen Sebelius? |
Fratricide is a strong word – I think it would be safer to say that Naismith feels that AARP promotes the interests of one generation at the expense of the future of all others. I could see them misrepresenting financial circumstances at the state level in an effort to fire up their subscribers. And MAC @ 40 – I stand by my orginial statement, which was not intended as a slight at all. Being the President is a much harder job than any of us can fathom. I believe anyone who has done it successfully for any length of time becomes overqualified for just about any other job in the world. It is really too early to judge the total impact, for good or ill, of this President. |
“Fratricide is a strong word – I think it would be safer to say that Naismith feels that AARP promotes the interests of one generation at the expense of the future of all others.” Okay, I would take that more moderate explanation…except that children actually do die, when Medicaid dollars are instead spent on nursing home care for elders who actually could pay for their own care except that they hired a lawyer to advise them how to “spend down” and transfer their assets to their adult children so that they will qualify for Medicaid, stealing money from the younger people for whom Medicaid is intended. The AARP is all about elders coming first. I would rather die than treat the next generation like that. Yes, they offer great discounts. But I’d rather be able to look at myself in the mirror. Oh, Kathleen Sebelius hired my research team some years ago, back when she was state insurance commissioner. I haven’t been surprised in the least at her success since. |
Whoa–AARP has death panels? |
Well, Naismith, my goodness, that’s just silly. I don’t endorse those policies and thank God for Medicaid when Mom was in the rest home. She only got a little social security and we couldn’t afford it. You should get back to me when you’re old. The information they put out was from Center on budget and policy priorities. It’s titled databank USA. State deficits. I suppose that could mean anything. |
I looked up the AARP data and they are reporting budget shortfalls. States make adjustments (usually spending cuts) to compensate for the shortfalls and balance their budgets each cycle. This is not an unusual occurrence when the economy is slow, particularly when housing values are down. I am pretty sure that only the federal government can carry debt from one budget cycle to another. |
Wouldn’t some of the data be true, though, as far as those four states being more fiscally in shape? |
Utah is in good fiscal shape, as reflected in its bond rating, yet it didn’t make the AARP list. I think that list is pretty meaningless because it looks only at one indicator of financial health, and not a particularly important one. |
I’m convinced we’re caught in a romantic comedy (chickflick) and that in two years Obama will be outside Palin’s window wearing a trenchcoat with Peter Gabriel playing on a stereo above his head. She will hop on his lawnmower and they will ride off into the sunset madly in love . . . credits. Because these characters can’t be real, can they? (yeah yeah, Easy A, I’m a completely unoriginal hack) |
DKL, Who predicted that Obama would win Utah? That’s just crazy talk. |
Annegb @ 56 – I am not so sure. All of those states have very low populations. That means less of a tax base, but also fewer service and infrastructure needs. I suspect that a low tax base/infrastructure setup is more ideal when the economy is not doing well-and that may be all these figures are really telling us. I think MCQ makes a good point about other factors perhaps being better indicators of a state’s financial health. |
B. Russ – Haven’t seen “Easy A.” I thought your reference was to “Say Anything.” |
Ed, it was a simultaneous reference to both “Can’t Buy Me Love” and “Say Anything”. Which “Easy A” also did. So not only am I unoriginal, I’m unoriginal in my unoriginality. |
McQ, you’re right and I was surprised not to see our name there. Although, I wouldn’t vote for our last two governors for president. BRuss. I’ve actually thought that about Sarah Palin–are you for real? But not the president. She’s over the top. I’m coming more and more to believe, disappointingly, that President Obama is mediocre. Ed, good point. Although, I was curious about there being three northern states and then, uh, Arkansas? |
Daniel! You kept it short! Good job! Who do you think, besides President Obama have been strong presidents? |
Obama’s speech was one of his best and historians will note it as such. He came across very Presidentai and reach his objective to heal and not to wound. He is being above partisan vitriol and urged Americans to find common ground and civility. His approval ratings are increasing and indeed he is showing more leadership . He touched people’s inner most passions of goodness . It was one of his finest hour. |
I have never commented here before. But just have to say that I 100% agree with Tim and Zion. Great speech with a worthy purpose. |
Alaska was just named 18th on the list of states most likely to go bankrupt. See here: http://www.thedailybeast.com/blogs-and-stories/2011-01-26/states-most-likely-to-go-bankrupt/ |
Alaska was just named number 18 on the list of states most likely to go bankrupt: http://www.thedailybeast.com/blogs-and-stories/2011-01-26/states-most-likely-to-go-bankrupt/ |